Tom Dwan Assumes Some Blame For The Apparent Tanking Epidemic In PokerSome Question If He's Overestimating His Influence |
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On Saturday morning, a Tweet from poker professional Daniel Negreanu rejuvenated the game’s complex and often muddled “shot clock” debate, which has been discussed numerous times over the years. Some live events have experimented with such an instrument, but there has never been any real uniformity in poker on the issue of players taking too long to act — one that can cause problems both in tournaments and in cash games.
Poker needs a shotclock of some kind. It’s become silly at this point how long each hand takes, often in mundane situations. #oi
— Daniel Negreanu (@RealKidPoker) October 6, 2012
That Tweet spawned a series of Tweets from Tom “durrrr” Dwan, who Doyle Brunson once described as “one of the slowest players [he] had ever played with.” In one of his Tweets, Dwan seems to say that he is part of the reason why tanking has become an epidemic in poker.
Dwan was a frequent participant on popular poker TV shows like High Stakes Poker and Poker After Dark, which featured some of the largest cash-game pots ever seen by the masses.
O and btw I agree that I sorta caused ppl taking so long (woulda happened anyway but maybe few yrs later). But I think lots now approach it
— Tom Dwan (@TomDwan) October 6, 2012
He finished the thought by saying:
Very wrong. When I was tanking I was legitimately thinking 75% or so of the time n balancing rest. Lots today are 90% hollywood 10% think
— Tom Dwan (@TomDwan) October 6, 2012
Dwan received many Retweets and replies, some in agreement, but at least two from people who didn’t really buy what the high-stakes poker pro was saying publicly.
To put it differently: Has Dwan been this influential to how the game is played?
@tomdwan you’re giving yourself WAY too much credit
— whitespur (@whitespurPstars) October 6, 2012
Another reply was a bit more critical:
@tomdwan So you’re tanking to think and the rest do it to Hollywood?Get over yourself.
— Jeff D (@PokerJeff21) October 6, 2012
Follow Brian Pempus on Twitter — @brianpempus
Comments
Jerome1
7 months ago
I only hollywood if I get 5 bet and have no hand because if I muck quickly that is just like turning my hand face up and letting everyone know that Im capable of making such a move with such a hand. You need people to think that you are layingdown a big hand if you 4 bet them. Cash games are another story. Ive never hollywooded because we are on time rake and the meta game isnt such a big deal.
Phil5
7 months ago
lol at this, this is one of the worst examples, when you 4bet you should know if ur going with ur hand. This is exactly the kind of stupid situation people do it in. Its pretty obvious that if you 4bet and then fold it was a bluff. There are not many situations where its correct to 4bet a value hand and fold to a 5bet. People do it live and online or like 3bet, a shove or fold stack and then when the guy sticks it in act like they have a decision, come on you know your folding, we know your folding, just do it already
Pete1
7 months ago
I love this terrible logic. Its way worse for your game and image if people think you are actually folding a real hand. No one thinks that anyway when you Hollywood, I dont care if you tanked for half an hour and then folded, I know you folded a bluff. If you don't know what you are doing already to a shove when you 4 bet, you have work to do on your game.
I_P_Freely
7 months ago
C'mon Phil & Pete, what's wrong with you guys?
Jerome actually thinks he's fooling people. Why spoil his delusion?
mp2012
7 months ago
Please describe a situation where you are 5bet folding... I can't imagine a time where that would be possible unless your a millionaire and are playing beyond deepstack against people who 4bet light a lot...
WPS22
7 months ago
Well, if you are like most other players, your 4 bet range is pretty polarized. Meaning you are either 4 betting with a hand you are dying to get it in with, or 4 betting light, knowing you are going to fold to a 5 bet.
So, when you tank then fold, most people just assume you were on the weak/bluff end of your 4 bet range anyway.
And, like has been pointed out, the rare times when someone thinks you are folding a big hand it isn't necessarily great for your image anyway.
Nearchu
7 months ago
He definitely had some influence, but at the same it is a logical decision to do hollywood or not. Sometimes you have a big decision to make, what you'll do on the next street and that comes into play when you're hollywooding. The people who take forever on hands if they have the nuts or air etc. can be frustrating due to them having an easy choice, however it will "balance" out their 'tells'. Thus, players on the table should tolerate the speed at people play as they feel comfortable playing slow, medium or fast. Once you take a player out of that zone, they may leave, play worse and give you money or the exact opposite.
Annette
7 months ago
hahahahaha i dont understand tankers, u should have a plan before each action.how hard is it ? seriously, if it takes you sooooooooo long to work shit out, maybe you should be elsewhere. hollywooders are even worse, they just like the lime light imo
Jared2
3 months ago
so true i agree if you know you're going to fold whats the point in taking so long
bmpek
7 months ago
donkey sums it up
RaiseMyNuttZ
7 months ago
omg, durrrrr is so full of himself. durrrr you're a very very weird dude. just watch his interviews, hmmmmmmmmmmmmm emmmmmmmmmmmm hmmmmmmmmmmmmm emmmmmmmmmmmm yea i'm very tired hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, you get it.
Jared2
3 months ago
i hate the way tom dwan thinks for half hour then folds yes he plays a lot of hands but most of what he does people can figure out i mean lots of videos out on the player but tom dwan isn't the cause of taking so long sometimes people just have decisions dwan had nothing to do with this taking so long stuff but yeah if you get 4 bet its usually a big hand if its just a typical internet player 5 bet them i mean they arent going to go all in just doesnt make sense unless they have a big hand and usually people are commited with the five bet so why even do it four bets is usually the sign of a big hand in the casino and off the casino